Red Spawn

Discussion in 'Issues & Reports' started by Durzek, Dec 1, 2018.

  1. Durzek

    Durzek New Member

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    Hello, Applecraft. It's your friendly Red-native and overly opinionated Drow, here to talk to you today about an opinion which is shared my many, if not most, of the Red server.

    Today we logged in to a whirl of confusion. A spawn which is familiar and alien all at once, and a scramble to type /red, only for the cheeky server to respond back "You are already on Red Server."

    I understand that the original 'Red spawn' was a fraction of Blue Spawn. But, as it was not the central starting point, it looked different enough. There were minor other differences, such as our parkour, that made us feel unique enough, happy enough.

    When advertised, this server was supposed to be "Semi/Mostly-Vanilla with ease-of-access plug-ins like claims and teleports." That's it, and that's what drew a great majority of us to this server. Near-basic experience with some rules & plug-ins in place to prevent headaches.

    Now we are a copy. Now we have shops. "Coming soon" is the fancy enchant shops.

    We, collectively, do not want to be Blue.
    We, collectively, do not want Eff6 and a bunch of rares and other things that detract from being a Mostly-Vanilla Survival Server.

    It is the concern of the great majority of Red that we will be getting these things, confirmed today by spawn being completely copied over from Blue.


    Please fix this, return us to having our OWN separate world. Many have threatened to leave over this.

    Please listen to your community... or many of us will leave.


    TL;DR, if you wanted both worlds to be the same, Red should have come with a "this world is temporary" warning.
    KeepInv vs Not KeepInv is not enough to keep us here.

    No one WANTS to leave. All we want is to be heard and made separate again. Have a real distinction between Red & Blue, give Red a little attention.
     
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  2. Inkyyy

    Inkyyy New Member

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    Durzek reaches many good points in this. Red needs to be different. One of the factors that made it so similar to blue, was the spawn. I did /spawn today and I thought I was in blue. While that is one of the smaller issues, I feel like red should have some differing rules to blue. While I understand why it has rares like blue, (I think it is so that everyone is included,) they should differ. Some of the items have become so overpowered, that they don't belong in red. The Satan's Chalice is a perfect example. During PVP, (or any other scenario,) if you right clicked the chalice, it would send you to the nether instantly. Even if your opponent followed you there, the area that the chalice sent you to was protected from PVP. giving the person who used the chalice an easy escape from being defeated. While I agree some items in red belong, like unbreakable tools, others are too overpowered and should not. I think red has changed too much, and partially for the better, but some of it has not. As I know, many red players pay a lot of money towards the server each week, and If red becomes a copy of blue, we may lose those donators. Red needs to have a different feel to it. Even though there is still grief, raiding, and no keep inventory, it is still really similar to blue. As you don't see many players higher than Master rank tpkilling anymore. With that gone, player shops added, and the same spawn, I see a twin to blue. While I understand that it can't be the easiest to run two different servers at a time, Applecraft has many willing staff on each server. And many staff members who transfer worlds everyday. If we could make Red different, it would be more enjoyable. As Stephen Covey once said, "Strength lies in differences, not in similarities." If red is not different than blue, we could lose half of our server, as the players from red would see no reason to play anymore. People need diversity, and red NEEDS change.
    -Inky
     
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  3. niceguy4

    niceguy4 New Member

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    I do appreciate the work that all the admins do to keep this server running smoothy however I am in some agreement that Red should be different then Blue. I do think that the shops are a big positive for the server as it makes trading so much easier. If the current design is to enhance the PVP experience then I think this would also be a positive change since PVP is extremely lacking on this server. Its lacking because there are no points of interest or things that draw people to a location that can create PVP interaction.
     
  4. Vixqn

    Vixqn New Member

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    I admit i felt like a bit of an idiot when it came to doing /spawn. There was just a big lag spike, and me standing in shop world, It displayed the joining world which happened to confuse me even more.. I embarrased myself in chat by saying "wtf i just did /spawn and im in blue world but im in red at the same time".. oops #RedSpawnCompetition
     
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  5. kk4pups_

    kk4pups_ New Member

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    Hi, I've never made a post before but I made an account literally just to say I absolutely hate the new spawn. 100% hate it. And I want the old one back. I really loved the old spawn, it was simple, streamlined, and we just got new trading rooms which I was excited about. Everyone in general seems very unhappy about the change and I'm no exception. I want old spawn back.
     
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  6. applebranch

    applebranch Owner Staff Member Owner

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    Hey @Durzek,

    I think you are conflating two issues here:
    1. New spawn on Red,
    2. Red becoming more like Blue.
    I want to be clear: just because I have put Blue's spawn in Red, doesn't mean that I want Red to become Blue. For example, I won't be putting the Legend Shop in the Red server, so you won't have to worry about Eff VI becoming available for example.

    I moved Blue's spawn over to Red for these reasons:
    1. Red was originally meant to have Blue's spawn, however when 1.13 first came out WorldEdit schematics broke and I wasn't able to transfer the whole thing over. Instead, I copied a small bit of it and pasted it in. The Red spawn was always going to be a temporary spawn.
    2. Red spawn was becoming too cluttered. There was no place to put a warp to the shops, a warp to the titan plots, etc.
    3. Giving Red and Blue the same spawn keeps things fair and equitable between the two servers. I don't want people on Red feeling like they're worse off, and I also don't want new players to think Blue is the "better" server because it has the nicer spawn.
    4. I prefer Blue spawn over Red spawn: it gives me more places to put events and additional information for players.
    So to be clear: changing Red's spawn to Blue's spawn does not change the underlying mechanics of Red server. These mechanics will not change. Red is the same today as it was yesterday, except with a new spawn.

    Finally, if you want a pure survival experience on Applecraft I will be releasing a new survival server this weekend which will feature:
    • No land claims,
    • No bonus commands for donors (e.g. /feed),
    • No unlimited /sethomes,
    • No OP/enchanted items ever,
    • No shops ever (but there will be a trading room at spawn),
    • Hard difficulty.
    If you'd prefer to play the new server rather than Red you're welcome to, or if you'd prefer to stay on Red that's fine too.
     
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  7. Durzek

    Durzek New Member

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    @applebranch

    When I was looking for a server to get back into MC, I searched for a few key terms: Vanilla (or as close as one can get), Claims, Sethomes, and 1.13. Obviously AC's Red server came up among my search results. I checked half a dozen servers and ended up coming back to AC; out of the servers I'd seen, AC felt the most home-like. The rules were in-line with what I was hoping for most. No fancy items, able to have claims, unlimited sethomes as a buyable option, donator ranks available for additional simple commands but nothing crazy. Very closely vanilla. In fact, having /heads at first concerned me because I was worried about shops and a /bal economy.
    When crates were added, there were mixed feelings from everyone. For the most part, we were having some fun with them. Multiple staff has also said we'd be getting Legend Shop and player shops. We now have player shops. Having copied over Blue's spawn, it also says "Coming Soon" by the Legend Shop.

    I don't believe I'm unjustifiably "conflagrating" these two points; they do go hand-in-hand. Because if Red is not becoming Blue, why is it literally the same?

    Keep Inv on Blue and PVP on Red is the only difference if we exclude legendshop.

    I've been told by admin that both having proof is useful, but that they don't need screenshots because the console can read the chat dialogue. So please, read today's reactions. Old players and new alike. There have been new players who came in, saw both spawns the same, and left. Blue players don't like it. Red players don't like it. It doesn't feel "equalizing," though I do understand your intention and I'm extremely sorry it didn't play out that way. Had it been a new spawn entirely, the reaction would have been overwhelmingly positive instead.
    Rather it feels as if Blue, again, is "winning". There are a lot of talented builders on both servers, some staff even. There could have been a competition to build onto Red's existing spawn with enough room to allow for portals and maintaining its own unique identity. Let the hot air balloon be one of the key landmarks that unites us (heck, make it more Apple-shaped :p).

    But the answer is to leave Red, you suggest? To give up all my donator commands when I don't even receive full command benefits at Red (some, like ClaimPVP flags, would make way more sense on Red even), to give up all the spawners I've bought, and go to a world where nothing is protected? That is not at all what I signed up for, what I searched for to find this place. I'm not asking for a cutt-throat server.

    Red just wants to be different, noticeably. For new players coming in, having two worlds with the exact same spawn is confusing. Why should they play one and not the other? The /rules aren't correct on Red, so there's no way they'd be able to tell from those alone what the differences are.

    I love this server, and I love this community, and no one's trying to be disrespectful in any way. It's because we care that we're concerned. No one wants to leave. There has to be another way.
    Creating a new world with no rules at all and telling your loyal players to give up all their possessions and go to where they'll never be able to truely defend anything they build or own sounds like apathy.

    We have too much passion for that. Please... please find another solution. v.v
     
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  8. applebranch

    applebranch Owner Staff Member Owner

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    @Durzek

    You're asking for a purely cosmetic change to the server which you're saying will somehow improve gameplay differences between Red and Blue.

    I'm not quite understanding why spawn has brought up this issue, and not the addition of shops (for example).
     
  9. Inkyyy

    Inkyyy New Member

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    if itll stop arguing ill build a new spawn for red <3
     
  10. niceguy4

    niceguy4 New Member

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    @applebranch

    Thank you for the clarification. What are your thoughts of creating some sort of area for PVP fights (in addition to wild)? Also, there seems to have been a lot of changes recently. Is it possible to post some of this communication on the announce thread or on the main page?
     
  11. Malpatch

    Malpatch New Member

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    If it'll stop people arguing, I'll blow up the current spawn for red. ♥

    I personally don't mind that Red and Blue have the same spawn layout, I like how much larger it is than the old one.
     
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  12. Thab3ast

    Thab3ast New Member

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